Author Topic: Proof that psychics are a fraud?  (Read 4541 times)

Jessi

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Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« on: March 20, 2012, 06:11:38 PM »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0Z7KeNCi7g

What do you think? Does he give sufficient evidence that they're nothing but frauds? Or do you think that only his examples are fraudulent psychics and that there are still good ones out there?

Hardison

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2012, 11:22:48 PM »

This man is really great. He has dedicated his life to expose those who prey upon the vulnerable.

When I worked at the Excalibur Casino in Las Vegas, Sylvia Browne was a big draw. Her shows always sold out. I had heard of her and knew that she has published dozens of books, but I really didn't give her much thought. Mentally, I put her in the same category as John Edwards.

hunysukle

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2012, 11:19:02 PM »
I have been to several psychics. Some of them were legit, others were not. There are people who are born with the ability to see the future. We shouldn't judge all psychics and claim that they're all scams. However, we should always be aware that many people claim to have psychic powers just to make money.

SifuPhil

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2012, 02:28:29 PM »
I respect Randi as a magician, but as an "exposer" I rapidly lose that respect. Not only does he seek to prove a negative, he's causing pain to those who DO believe.

It's the equivalent of an atheist forcing a Christian to dis-believe in God - even if it were true, you've just ruined a person's life.

Jessi

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2012, 03:04:31 AM »
I respect Randi as a magician, but as an "exposer" I rapidly lose that respect. Not only does he seek to prove a negative, he's causing pain to those who DO believe.

It's the equivalent of an atheist forcing a Christian to dis-believe in God - even if it were true, you've just ruined a person's life.

Most times, I wouldn't expect a true believer to be watching him anyway. And even if it were sent to them by someone who wanted to use it to disprove their beliefs, I doubt it'd do any good. Realistically, it's going to be like taking an atheist to church. They're going to dismiss the "miracles" they're being told about, just as a religious person is going to dismiss this guy's "magic" and claim, for example, not every psychic is like that, etc.

SifuPhil

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2012, 02:20:24 PM »
Most times, I wouldn't expect a true believer to be watching him anyway. And even if it were sent to them by someone who wanted to use it to disprove their beliefs, I doubt it'd do any good. Realistically, it's going to be like taking an atheist to church. They're going to dismiss the "miracles" they're being told about, just as a religious person is going to dismiss this guy's "magic" and claim, for example, not every psychic is like that, etc.
True enough I suppose.

But then Randi would just be tooting his own horn - which actually wouldn't surprise me, since he's such a fanboy of Houdini and Houdini was known far and wide not so much as a skilled magician but as an excellent showman and marketer.

SirTenenbaum

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2012, 02:41:08 PM »
I respect Randi as a magician, but as an "exposer" I rapidly lose that respect. Not only does he seek to prove a negative, he's causing pain to those who DO believe.

It's the equivalent of an atheist forcing a Christian to dis-believe in God - even if it were true, you've just ruined a person's life.

I'm a former Christian, now atheist, and I am much happier as an atheist. Somebody deciding to reject their previous beliefs is not necessarily "destroying" someone's life. Furthermore, if somebody got immense joy from believing in Santa Clause when you know he does not exist, does that make it OK to delude themselves? More importantly, is it OK for people to take advantage of that person's belief in Santa Clause? Finally, it's not the equivalent of an atheist "forcing" a Christian to disbelieve in God. It's the equivalent of an atheist providing arguments against the existence of God leading to the Christian deciding to agree with the atheist and reject his previous held beliefs in God.

SifuPhil

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2012, 07:14:04 PM »
I'm a former Christian, now atheist, and I am much happier as an atheist. Somebody deciding to reject their previous beliefs is not necessarily "destroying" someone's life.
When they reject it themselves, no. When someone ELSE seeks to reject it FOR them, yes.

Quote
Furthermore, if somebody got immense joy from believing in Santa Clause when you know he does not exist, does that make it OK to delude themselves?
Yes. My beliefs, as long as they don't intrude upon others, are of no concern to anyone but me.

And Randi does not KNOW that psychics do not exist, anymore than we do. It's his PERSONAL belief.

Quote
More importantly, is it OK for people to take advantage of that person's belief in Santa Clause?
There you might have a point, but is it really taking advantage? Aren't they providing solace? Isn't that what ANY of our beliefs (or non-beliefs) do?

Quote
Finally, it's not the equivalent of an atheist "forcing" a Christian to disbelieve in God. It's the equivalent of an atheist providing arguments against the existence of God leading to the Christian deciding to agree with the atheist and reject his previous held beliefs in God.
The way I've seen Randi carry on, I would call him an evangelist of non-belief. To offer a million dollars to create a phenomenon under HIS conditions is hubris, just like Houdini's "Challenge" escapes: he offered big cash rewards to anyone that could keep him imprisoned, but he always did the challenges under HIS terms and conditions to allow for complete control. There's nothing, no Universal law that we know of, that says that a phenomenon WOULDN'T occur in his lab but COULD somewhere else.

Randi has flatly denied the POSSIBILITY unless it occurs under HIS control; for this I don't respect his work in this field.

Beckybooboo

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2012, 09:20:16 PM »
Hi,

I personally from my own experiences and family members experiences believe that all psychics are fraudulent.

I believe that there are some that are very good, as the ones that me and my family have been too have been on point and 10/10 all the time.

I think that there ARE frauds out there, but whether or not the people are unlucky to get caught up in them is a different story.

All the best,
Becky
Life always gives you a second chance, it's called tomorrow.

taskeinc

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2012, 06:21:33 AM »
Watched the video, he's only sharing his opinion on psychics but he's painting all psychics with a broad stroke. I'd be inclined to agree that the majority of people who refer to themselves as psychic may not be able to foresee things or communicate with those who have transitioned.

He's a comical fellow but, 81 years of age, and he's only sharing his experience with psychic phenomenon.

I came across a psychic by accident on (of all places) Myspace. About 4 years ago, met a lady on Myspace who lived in North Carolina.

There are different types of psychics: Clairaudience, they hear; Clairvoyance, they see visions; Clairsentience, they feel the presence of the deceased and can usually tell how someone passed. For example, they will get a tightness in their chest (heart attack) or a tightness around the throat, if a person may have choked, or committed suicide via hanging himself, etc.

The lady in NC was Clairsentient and that was actually what she did for a living. However, I did not meet her in that capacity. We met online and I attempted to get to know her better. We emailed one another for about a week or two, then we exchanged numbers. In our emails and later in our phone conversation, we never talked about her line of work, nor did I ask about it.

About an hour into our phone conversation, she mentioned that she could see auras around people, even if she were speaking to the person over the phone. I didn't really believe her so I sort of asked in a sarcastic manner, what color is my aura? She stated that it was a brownish color which indicates I like to work with soil, dirt, flowers, and plants. I never shared with her that I am always surrounded by plants. Then and now, I have over 60 plants in my home, several in my office, where I am right now, and I was in my office, in another home, when I was speaking with her. As usual, I was surrounded by plants.

Horticulture is my passion, I have a couple of house plants that I've had over 20 years, some I've had 10 years, and others that are 5-6 years old. I rarely buy plants anymore because I can just place clippings in water and in a month or so, another plant.

G.W. Bush was president then and I asked her what color was his aura? She stated that it was a grey or dark grey color which indicates a sinister element or something not being right with that particular person.

We continued talking and about 30 to 45 minutes later she asked me (out of the blue, never brought this up to her), did I have a brother? I said yes, but he passed in 1992. She asked me if he had a problem with his heart, I said YES. She told me that she felt a pain in her chest and she could sense his presence around her. His message was, "I'm OK."

Once again, I never asked questions about her psychic ability, nor was she trying to sell me anything or conduct business, I was talking to her initially on a personal level. That's the last conversation she and I had, it was actually the first and the last conversation. We just lost contact after that. I truly believe that is why our paths crossed on the Internet, for that one conversation, that my brother used to get through to me.

Not making any of this up, that is why I believe the old guy in the video is only speaking from his own perspective.

I've attached one of my favorite plants .. this one is about 5 years old; it's a hybrid container garden, 6 plants in one container (pothos, 2 types of philodendron, scandapsus, spineless yucca, hoya). I started the plant from cuttings, placed in water, then transferred to a pot, it's been re-potted about 3 times, and it grows like weeds...

I digress, but only showing my love for plants and how this particular psychic was so ON POINT..



« Last Edit: August 12, 2012, 06:48:15 AM by taskeinc »
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Eliza64

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2012, 12:26:15 PM »
Just like in any other profession there are people who are frauds.  Its ignorant to judge all people by the actions of a few.   Its like seeing a bad doctor and saying all doctors are bad because one is.  It doesn't make sense to me.

I have seen many good psychics and many bad ones.  Some have more skill then others.    I do believe simply because I have experienced it myself.

writer811

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2012, 07:06:12 PM »
I'm a strong believer in never dismissing an entire group of people just because a select few turn out to be in need of dismissing. I've met psychics who were literally able to tell me what I was thinking, word for word (And I wasn't just thinking dumb things like "I don't think you're psychic". I was thinking really specific, random things like "Mary had a little lamb and Peter had his pickled peppers and they got together and made a baby!" to minimize the chances of fraud) and I've met psychics who are accurate in their predictions 99 percent of the time.

Sandra Piddock

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #12 on: August 17, 2012, 04:02:32 PM »
Yes there are psychics who are frauds, just as there are frauds in every other area of life. Some people cheat because it's the only way they know, but there are genuine psychics out there - I've met a couple myself. That's not strictly true - one was through a phone conversation on a local radio programme. I wanted to find out if the psychic was genuine, so I called in.

The things she said to me were things she could not possibly have known, as I had never before been in contact with her. As well as telling me things about my past, she also predicted my health problems, about two years before I became aware of them myself. This woman only had my voice to go on, yet she was very accurate. The psychic I met was just a random meeting, and again, she was very accurate about my past and those I had lost.

What swung it for both of these ladies was that neither of them wanted to be paid for their small services to me. That tells me they were genuine people who truly wanted to help.

Mouse

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Re: Proof that psychics are a fraud?
« Reply #13 on: August 17, 2012, 05:33:48 PM »
I agree with those of you who feel there are frauds and there are genuine people with a gift. The problem, I think, with the whole psychic issue is that there are bound to be frauds that know they are a fraud. But also frauds that have the belief that they are actually psychic, through self-delusion or whatever who just want to help people. So, separating those with a gift and those deluding themselves is difficult.


I don't think much of Randi Wossname just because his arguments only seem to serve his own purpose, rather than counteracting the assertions he is trying to disprove. For example, I once saw him eat an entire bottle of homeopathic pills, (I haven't watched the video in the first post so I don't know if that's in it) and then he showed the audience how he wasn't dying. Now, regardless of what I think about homeopathy, I know that this isn't how homeopaths claim their treatments work. They don't claim that the substances they use work in the same way that a man-made pharmaceutical does and so it is impossible to overdose on a homeopathic medicine. Thus eating a bottle of the pills, does nothing but prove his ignorance, (and arrogance).

I understand Randi wanting to execute his challenge under his own conditions, if it were purely to ensure a scientific method. However, that's probably not the case. I wonder if someone actually managed to pass such a challenge of his, whether he'd actually pay out the money, or would come up with an explanation as to why they passed.



« Last Edit: August 17, 2012, 05:35:20 PM by Mouse »
My karma ran over your dogma.


 

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